libera/commonlisp - IRC Chatlog
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19:17:16
edgar-rft
skeemer: I usually write gnuplot data into a file and then use gnuplot from the commandline, but here are some other alternatives -> https://www.cliki.net/plotting
19:32:05
phoe
literate programming time - https://github.com/phoe/articles/blob/main/2022-01-29-static-let/static-let.md
19:37:25
White_Flame
isn't literate programming usually about being documentation with code interspersed?
19:40:08
phoe
White_Flame: I think it is - I kind of abuse this idea to also include stuff that teaches writing Lisp in general
19:51:23
moon-child
phoe: 'we did not supply the second argument to LOAD-TIME-VALUE, which creates constant data' I think this would be clearer as 'we did not supply a second argument to LOAD-TIME-VALUE, which lets us create constant data'
19:52:23
moon-child
I'm also not sure if the use of the uninterned symbol clarifies or obscures intent. Depends on your audience, probably, but
22:39:01
phoe
flip214: https://github.com/armedbear/abcl/issues/433 looks like Alexandria might need to adjust its TYPE= tests for cases where one SUBTYPEP returns T T and the inverse SUBTYPEP returns NIL NIL
0:06:09
etimmons
Shinmera: trivial gray streams has file-position, and I'm pretty sure it works on most implementations
2:49:32
Guest74
is there a way to add/view documentation for a specific method of a generic function?
3:00:32
dbotton
if there a popular library for doing text templates? I am looking to generate "scaffolding" for projects, ie. an asdf file, some basic lisp files, etc. much of which a simple replace of some symbol would do.
3:01:48
White_Flame
it would be nice if backquoted forms could be passed around, but they can't. You could use a macro for an active template
3:03:52
dbotton
The idea is to have a set of files and just replace some text in each and write them out to some directory
3:04:11
Guest74
I don't see how typing out exactly what the page says is any help when I said I don't understand what is on the page.
3:04:47
mfiano
Common Lisp is a class-based language. If you don't know the function for getting a method instance, it is find-method
3:05:07
mfiano
I'm sorry, but I can't write code for you right now. Those are the signatures you need.
3:05:18
EdLangley[m]
I’m not at my laptop at the moment, and the details here are implementation-dependent
3:05:31
White_Flame
dbotton: here's a functional, short, but janky way of using backquotes: https://plaster.tymoon.eu/view/2898#2898
3:07:35
White_Flame
there's really no difference in having that sort of literal backquoted form, and a macro body I guess
3:08:48
EdLangley[m]
But, if you’re generating lisp source it’d be better to take advantage of lisp’s builtin templating mechanisms.
3:10:51
EdLangley[m]
(let ((*print-case* :downcase)) (pprint `(asdf:defsystem ,name . . .) *file-stream*))
3:23:49
mfiano
I was about to direct them to #clschool. I can't remember all the guests that come here.
3:55:18
dbotton
Is there a simple tutorial on presentations in CLIM/McCLIM around? Something very practical?
3:57:58
beach
dbotton: But most participants are probably still asleep, and jackdaniel is not quite well yet, perhaps.
3:59:21
mfiano
beach: Do you think it is worth reading for an experienced Common Lisper? I am getting the vibe that it was Symbolics marketing for what OOP should be, and I'm unsure if I would learn anything from it.,
4:00:41
beach
If you already use CLOS, then probably no. And I didn't much like the book, mainly because the (in my opinion) badly chosen examples.
4:03:43
beach
mfiano: I read the Keene book and didn't understand much of how to use CLOS. Then I read the CLIM II specification, and I understood a lot more.
4:07:32
mfiano
I see. I have not much interest in graphical interfaces, or graphical environments for that matter, so I am unsure if I could stomach it. I prefer working at a terminal.
4:10:39
beach
Josh_2: Sure, it is not completely worthless. It does contain the basics of CLOS. But I suspect mfiano already knows that much.
4:11:22
mfiano
I do know quite a bit of CLOS and the MOP already, but I think there needs to be more books on practical applications of them.
4:11:54
beach
I totally agree. I have some partially finished books, but every book project is stalled now.
4:12:08
mfiano
I think AMOP was a terrible techical book (like most of them). It could have used a couple dozen more copy editors and maybe a typesetter or 3.
4:13:53
mfiano
AMOP was pretty painful to read because of my attention to detail. I had to ask a lot of questions when the book was plain wrong or contradicted itself in various places.
4:13:59
beach
My book projects depend on having a coauthor to take care of the copy editing, precise organization, LaTeX details, etc. But my favorite coauthor essentially abandoned me. Then phoe was going to help me with one of my books, but then got very busy with lots of other stuff.
4:14:55
beach
mfiano: I started it twice without finishing. It was only on my third attempt that I managed to read to the end. And that was after learning a lot more of CLOS from the CLIM specification.
4:15:18
beach
dre: Please don't post links without an explanation of what we can expect if we follow them.
4:15:31
mfiano
Who is your favorite coauthor? I take it that is an abbreviation to auto-complete, but it is slightly annoying we never know who that is :)
4:16:23
beach
mfiano: Oh, "everybody" knows. Her name is Irène Durand, and sometimes comes here as idurand.
4:16:44
beach
mfiano: She is the only coauthor on my papers and books. So it is not hard to be the favorite one. :)
4:18:37
beach
mfiano: And I can already tell that he is essentially never going to be available, so I gave up on him.
4:19:27
mfiano
I think that is accurate. phoe is doing amazing work for the community, but he moves around a lot.
4:21:43
beach
My favorite coauthor was perfect. She knows her domain very well. She is meticulous and hard working. And she lives not too far from me, so we can easily meet. But she has changed her priorities of how she likes to spend her time.
4:22:48
moon-child
mfiano: waitaminit, if you don't like graphical environments, why are you writing a colour library?
4:24:24
mfiano
moon-child: That is a good question. I don't like using a graphical interface. Most computing tasks can be done perfectly fine with a command line interface. However, just because I like algorithmic art and generating imagery, doesn't mean I have to use the mouse or interact with GUI widgets.
4:25:31
moon-child
I think there are myriad opportunities to take advantage of graphical organization for better presentation of information
4:29:49
mfiano
Not just ergonomic disasters, but everytime I have to take my fingers off the keyboard to reach for the mouse, usually means I'm switching to some other context, which is a huge productivity disaster, and even a few milliseconds can disrupt "flow".
4:30:30
mfiano
My workflow is entirely keyboard oriented, except for very few tasks that are unavoidable.
4:32:23
moon-child
to me, the problem is not switching. The problem is that mice are generally used to choose from among discrete objects and perform discrete actions, a task to which (as analogue instruments) they are not well suited
4:33:14
mfiano
I also tend to try to keep a similar working environment across all my hardware, some virtual/remote even.