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7:48:38
nij-
bike Apparently, this is a talk note given by Kent Pitman http://nhplace.com/kent/Papers/cl-untold-story.html
7:50:23
nij-
And Kent Pitman's stance was (paraphrased) "No, we can't give you (ANSI) the copyright. It's the work of many people. And X3J13 doesn't "own" it.""
7:51:00
nij-
At the end the compromise seems to be that Kent telling ANSI that if they put a page of copyright claim, no one will ever tell.
7:51:37
nij-
Again, this is only Kent's word. But if this is true, I don't think ansi can lawfully claim that they own dpANS.
7:53:13
nij-
If one parsed and represented dpANS correctly, that itself is a merit and may be enough to claim "novelty", granting the possibility to claim copyleft.
7:53:44
nij-
Legally and realistically speaking, that sounds pretty fine for me. (Ofc Im no law person.)
10:19:38
paulapatience
There is no question that modifying dpANS3 would result in a copyrightable derived work
10:20:40
paulapatience
Just as there's no question that it would be a derived work, which as you pointed out, is probably not an issue.
10:22:03
paulapatience
However, Kent's words would not prevent ANSI from potentially filing a lawsuit, indeed people can file lawsuits for whatever reason (at least in the USA I think)
10:45:14
splittist
If all the folks who had put time and effort into automatically parsing dpANS had just typed out different bits, we'd have a completely rewritten copy by now.
12:17:06
bike
"They didnt really think about it until it was brought up" sounds pretty normal for engineers
12:18:07
bike
ANSI probably isn't going to sue anyone, practically speaking, given that as beach mentioned they don't even care enough about the CL standard to keep the original sources
15:05:14
nij-
splittist The point is that we'd like to stick to a standard that has been used for years.
15:05:48
nij-
So hopefully, the transition from dpANS3 to whatever successor is well-documented and well-spreaded to people.
15:06:51
nij-
How about doing this anomonously? Like flying to a non US territory, publish the parsed result with copyleft without trace into the internet?
15:10:50
bike
copyleft is a legal concept. if you publish something illegally and give it a copyleft license, if it actually came up in court the judge would just go well this supposed copyright is invalid
15:12:07
bike
please don't try to loophole your way through legal systems. there's a reason lawyers exist
15:12:49
bike
the more pressing issue for a standard is the social problem of getting everybody on board with it. comparatively i don't think the legal stuff is a big deal since ANSI probably doesn't care
15:13:43
splittist
nij-: copyleft is a red herring. As long as no-one is claiming others' work as their own or trying to make money from the standard, the chances of any legal action from disseminating a 'new'/'reworded' version of dpANS are negligible. (But IANYL.)
15:21:24
nij-
I see. I just find this unsettling. But maybe you all are right. Without a law professional we can't go far anyway. And there's more pressing issues now indeed.