libera/#shirakumo - IRC Chatlog
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11:56:13
Colleen
scymtym: Shinmera said 7 minutes, 5 seconds ago: What happened to 'whole-parameter-group' in CST? It's no longer external.
11:58:46
scymtym
ah, right, one thing was: when playing under linux with a gamepad, the desktop session seems to be considered idle. is that expected behavior?
11:59:29
Colleen
<shinmera> It is not expected. I did add stuff that should prevent it, but it just doesn't work and I do not understand why.
12:00:40
Colleen
<shinmera> I didn't want to pull in the mess that is dbus for this, but I have considered it.
12:01:03
scymtym
i can very well imagine the freedesktop crowd just ignoring the X mechanism and rolling their own
12:01:35
Colleen
<shinmera> even though xset does exactly the same under the hood, I checked the sources.
12:02:12
Colleen
<shinmera> But yeah, using dbus seems like it would be more robust. Only problem is using dbus is not easy :(
12:02:15
scymtym
maybe it depends on which process does. but ok, i can see why you don't want further complication in that area
12:02:33
Colleen
<shinmera> I definitely do want to fix screensaving crap from happening before release
12:03:14
scymtym
may some handcrafted one-off dbus message over a raw socket would suffice, but i bet there can be non-standard socket paths and so on
12:04:30
scymtym
another thing was that the child found it strange that the character portraits weren't holding radios while talking over the radio
12:05:01
Colleen
<shinmera> Ah. Yeah I can see that. I do want to at least add an effect layer on top for people that aren't "there".
12:06:09
scymtym
otherwise i can report that the story and gameplay where engaging enough to keeping reading through dialog for about an hour at a time :)
12:06:55
Colleen
<shinmera> How did you do the translation? off the cuff, or did you actually modify the scripts?
12:07:37
scymtym
while translating, i ran into some issues that aren't present in english such as du/sie, translating place names and how to refer to alex
12:08:09
scymtym
if you can provide feedback for those, i can try to make the translation a bit better
12:08:22
Colleen
<shinmera> Fwiw documentation on the characters is here: https://kandria.com/characters
12:09:13
Colleen
<shinmera> I can give you commit bit on the internal repo so you could push things to a branch. I think that would be easiest to keep stuff synced.
12:09:23
scymtym
i went with du everywhere except when the stranger talks to people that aren't Catherine. seems a bit arbitrary in hindsight
12:12:17
Colleen
<shinmera> If you want to directly push to our repo, you'll need an account at https://auth.tymoon.eu/register
12:12:36
scymtym
i also hacked cl-gamedpad a bit to work with an gamepad i had lying around. but that's not actionable, i think, because probably no else has such a thing and it is technically not compatible with the minimal requirements
12:13:08
Colleen
<shinmera> Oh, was the hack to remove the check for minimal buttons and such that eliminates devices?
12:13:28
Colleen
<shinmera> I've been thinking about that, because I also have one gamepad that gets eliminated because of that
12:13:48
Colleen
<shinmera> Lessening the requirements causes inclusion of wrong devices like the Cintiq drawing pad though so :/
12:14:08
scymtym
but the one i is closer to an SNES controller than dual-stick, so it really is unsuitable
12:15:11
Colleen
<shinmera> I have things in there for flight sticks and such as well, but don't have any to test with.
12:15:29
scymtym
apparently "Logitech Logitech(R) Precision(TM) Gamepad". i don't have it in front of me right now
12:17:34
scymtym
the registration form thinks jmoringe@techfak.uni-bielefeld.de is not a valid email address
12:25:52
scymtym
right, i forgot gitea can ssh because we can't use it because of corporate firewall bs
12:27:42
Colleen
<shinmera> I know we have a couple of things that aren't amicable to switching languages yet, but actually having a new language should go a long way towards ironing that out :)
12:28:11
Colleen
<shinmera> I do also want to make a swiss german translation at some point, but I think I'll hold off on that until we have all quests done.
12:28:35
scymtym
right, i couldn't find things like "Received ITEM", for example. but i also haven't looked very hard
12:29:33
Colleen
<shinmera> Iif you look through the log you'll find commit messages of extremely varying quality, so
12:31:53
Colleen
<shinmera> Were there any other problems you encountered? With scripts and whatever?
12:32:33
Colleen
<shinmera> That takes some load off my mind, because I have been worried about eventual localisation.
12:32:49
Colleen
<shinmera> The typicaly thing localisation firms are used to is an excel sheet of stuff to translate, not something on this level.
12:35:44
scymtym
see https://gitea.tymoon.eu/shinmera/kandria/src/branch/german-translation/lang/de/Questions.org for, well, questions
12:39:33
Colleen
<shinmera> I have been working on Forge during my holidays. It's still far from done, but getting closer to something that can do things. Once it's usable it'll allow for extensive modding of the game
12:41:00
scymtym
haha. well, coding-wise his current level is more like https://codecombat.com/parents
12:42:30
Colleen
<shinmera> selwyn: Not in the market of "I'll pay for them now" as that's still too early. I'll hire localisation firms once we're close to release. But I am in the market of "very interested in community contributions and also willing to lend a hand"
12:42:42
scymtym
i think making something like that for kandria would be cool. even if just to avoid python :)
12:42:59
Colleen
<shinmera> I think the dialogue and quest system is pretty easy to get started with.
12:44:29
Colleen
<shinmera> Sure, I'd feel bad about not designing something from the ground up for it though.
12:49:32
scymtym
i think you must now specify whether you want an ordinary or destructuring whole parameter group: https://github.com/s-expressionists/Concrete-Syntax-Tree/commit/dcb186c6c681ca057760aaa2cbd7807c7d0bc6eb
12:50:57
Colleen
<shinmera> scymtym: so just replacing it with ordinary-whole-parameter-group should work
12:52:13
scymtym
i think so. we weren't completely sure which situations should and shouldn't destructure. but ordinary will almost certainly work for existing code
12:55:30
Colleen
<shinmera> I do need to see about a contract to include your work in the official game
12:57:21
Colleen
<shinmera> yeah, something that lets me use your work for commercial and promontional purposes, and ensures that you're properly credited for your work wherevere credits are applicable.
12:58:11
scymtym
i don't see a problem with that. unless it ends up being more work than the actual translation, of course
12:58:30
Colleen
<shinmera> Won't be anything big, but I do need to draft it up since I haven't done anything like that before outside of actual work contracts.
13:04:52
scymtym
oh, one more thing: if you can, please limit the amount of fishing that can be done in a given pond and time period. children (probably not the target audience per se) can't handle the randomized rewards + collectibles combination. being able to farm infinite money may also take away from the challenge for players that can handle the addictive nature
13:05:44
scymtym
not being able to pull tons of stuff out of basically a puddle may also be more realistic :)
13:09:57
Colleen
<shinmera> the fishing is meant to be a relaxing / completionist activity, and the rewards aren't very big.
13:11:47
Colleen
<shinmera> But it is a valid concern. So I wonder if there's other ways to make it less of a problem without punishing the original intent.
13:12:30
Colleen
<shinmera> The cheap solution (for me) would be to add another gameplay option to set the behaviour.
13:13:24
scymtym
yes, could be tied to difficulty settings (if those are planned) or child-suitable-ish mode (along with the swear-word thing)
13:13:45
Colleen
<shinmera> I don't plan on difficulty levels, just sliders to adjust damage input/output.
13:14:37
scymtym
i can see that the current solution may be better in general, but i may have to put something in
13:15:17
scymtym
as i said, for some reason, the random rewards and collectible combination is really powerful
13:20:42
Colleen
<shinmera> scymtym: would it help if we added an option to prevent you from selling them?
13:22:53
scymtym
for the difficulty/challenge aspect, sure. for the "having difficulties stopping to fish" aspect, probably not. but again, this may not be a concern for the target audience