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13:54:30
francogrex
Hi, for learning, I am trying to "optimize" this (and it's not high level optimization), only at the declarations level: https://benchmarksgame-team.pages.debian.net/benchmarksgame/program/pidigits-sbcl-3.html
13:57:10
francogrex
a lot of unable to do inline fixnum arithmetic, because of the integer/fixnum thing there
14:07:19
jackdaniel
sbcl tells you that if /you could/ guarantee that these integers are fixnums, then it would be able to apply a certain optimization
14:16:00
francogrex
jackdaniel: ok, i am sure i cannot guarantee that the output of the arithmetic operations will be fixnum (actually i can guarantee that they will not be :( )
14:18:07
francogrex
i though there would be a way for optimized integer operations without using fixnums
14:21:21
aeth
some notes are inherently unfixable, but you probably still want optimized code to be optimized so you can just hide the remaining notes in a LOCALLY
14:21:40
aeth
well, no, sometimes SBCL complains that the problem isn't... an easier to optimize problem
14:22:07
aeth
Especially when there's division. Like, thanks, if I was solving a different problem, it would really work out.
14:23:16
aeth
You could experiment with TYPECASE and having a fast path and a slow path, but the slow path will then always complain (unless moved to a separate function entirely)
14:37:42
aeth
That being said, depending on the problem, you could make your own "bignum" out of a fixed-size array of numbers that are all known to be of a fixed size and thus fully optimizable. Definitely doable for simpler things (especially if you just want the bits of an integer, or just want to add). Probably not doable if you want to use all of the features of a bignum (writing your own EXPT, division, etc., is
15:08:55
lisp123
I assume I can't have generic functions & functions named by the same symbol in the same package?
15:12:08
beach
lisp123: What would that mean? How would the system know which one you refer to when you say (NAME ...)?
15:13:04
lisp123
beach: Yeah that's what I was thinking. Was hoping for the system to try the global function after exhausting all generic function options
15:15:39
lisp123
So what I have is, an accessor function for a CLOS slot (which from reading online is a generic function), say object-slot-name --> I want to then write a function called object-slow-name to generate the value to populate this slot
15:26:22
jcowan
pjb: That's why I want to get the Common Lisp in Medley updated to the ANS, so that all those tools *will* be vaailable. "Develop in Medley, deploy in SBCL!" Only you can't quite, yet.
16:30:12
jcowan
e.g. IL: is case-sensitive but all standard symbols are uppercase (you need your CAPS LOCK key)
16:31:17
jcowan
Medley will boot and run file, and you can start either a CL or IL REPL. The main problem with CL is that it is basically CLtL1. Some work (nobody yet knows how much) was done to add CLtL2 facilities.
16:33:27
jcowan
CL has NLAMBDA (elsewhere known as FEXPR) pseudo-functions, which look like macros to CL; I'm not sure if the reverse is true. But IL isn't that big a language: the Interlisp teams in the past worked on tooling, not on embiggening the library.
16:34:25
beach
I see, so getting full ANSI Common Lisp is a bigger problem than getting the Interlisp environment to work.
16:53:11
cheers
beach: How close is SICL to being completed? totally fine if you don’t have an exact estimate
17:22:17
jcowan
_death: Yes, in the CL Exec (REPL) you are using the CL readtable instead of the IL readtable. If you start an IL Exec then nil should not work but NIL will.
19:03:29
Posterdati
please help, how is it possible to simulate a button click on a webpage using drakma?
19:46:00
shka
if by "using" you mean using getf, it is reasonably common if you have function with &rest argument
19:47:11
jcowan
Agreed, but isn't that what &key is all about? When do you need to process them yourself?
19:50:59
shka
it is from what i noticed used less often for actually long term storing of dictionaries
19:52:50
jcowan
"Dicts" in Scheme-to-be are a generic interface to key-value stores, including HAMTs, alist, and hashtables.
19:53:41
jcowan
Allowing plists as a kind of dict means that () can be either an empty alist or an empty plist, you don't know which.
20:13:51
AnimalClatter
If I recall correctly, Common Lisp Recipes makes the point that plists have a simplicity and readability that would lend themselves to, e.g., a config file
20:35:36
mfiano
In combination with #'APPLY for example, especially if you want to override just a single key/value (earlier ones take precedence)
22:15:54
NotThatRPG
Is there a CL library that has an equivalent of the Unix "find" utility? Or something like the (admittedly kind of scary) perl find library?
22:17:12
NotThatRPG
@xach: Given the mismatches in the various CL interfaces to the file system, that isn't entirely surprising, but it is kind of disappointing.
22:18:48
lotuseater
ha yes I could try when it comes to that. there's no #'(setf array-element-type) in default
22:19:14
Bike
there is no way to do that. adjust-array is how you change arrays, but there's no defined behavior for changing element type
22:21:28
xach
NotThatRPG: i've been using wild-inferiors to look through file trees but not in very complicated ways
22:22:27
lotuseater
so expanding at compiletime and throw an error if it won't be specialized by pushing some value
22:23:00
NotThatRPG
lotuseater: You mean for CHANGE-CLASS. I did once upon a time have a real use for CHANGE-CLASS, but I can't for the life of me remember what it was.
22:24:52
NotThatRPG
@xach: Not tasty, but it works: (uiop:run-program (format nil "find ~a -type f -name \"*run-all.lisp\" -print" (namestring (asdf:system-relative-pathname "shop3" "examples/"))) :output :lines)
22:25:51
xach
NotThatRPG: (directory (system-relative-pathname "shop3" "examples/**/*run-all.lisp")) is what I'd use
22:26:44
lotuseater
xach: I once asked friends "so can your Java (or another blub) change classes in such a way at runtime?" :D
22:29:56
NotThatRPG
pve: Would that work? I have stopped using CL-FAD because it isn't able to identify when a directory entry is a file or a subdirectory (because it is too trusting of the form of CL pathnames).
22:30:49
pjb
Bike: I beg to differ. adjust-array lets you change the element-type, with the constraint that: If element-type is supplied, the consequences are unspecified if the upgraded array element type of element-type is not the same as the actual array
22:31:57
pjb
So (let ((a (make-array 3 :element-type '(integer 3 10) :initial-element 10))) (adjust-array a (array-dimensions a) :element-type '(integer 10 100))) #| --> #(10 10 10) |# is perfectly conforming AFAICS.
22:32:39
pjb
(let ((a (make-array 3 :element-type '(integer 3 10) :initial-element 10))) (adjust-array a (array-dimensions a) :element-type '(integer 100 200))) #| --> #(10 10 10) |# might also be, until the printer tries to read the elements.
22:34:17
pve
NotThatRPG: i guess you could double check in the function given to walk-directory with better definition of what a directory is, and then call walk-directory recursively
22:34:45
pjb
lotuseater: so (let ((a (make-array 3 :element-type '(integer 3 10) :initial-element 10))) (adjust-array a (array-dimensions a) :element-type '(integer 10 100)))
22:35:13
NotThatRPG
pve: I will have a look, thanks. I should probably double-check UIOP and make sure it does not have such a beast in it.
22:36:31
pve
NotThatRPG: uiop at least has a definition for how to identify directories, it's what I use in my own walk-directory
22:37:03
NotThatRPG
pve: Yes, that's right, because it can't be done in pure CL, and i think CL-FAD is pure CL.
22:37:48
NotThatRPG
pve: Even the superhuman Fare could not make symlinks work consistently across lisps, though!
22:40:02
NotThatRPG
pve: Alas, no: "Note that this does _not_ check to see that pathname points to an actually-existing directory. "
22:41:52
NotThatRPG
There's a longstanding ASDF bug related to this, that I don't believe we can fix.
22:48:11
pve
NotThatRPG: can you help me understand what exactly causes the problem (it's a bit late here)? If I symlink a directory into another directory foo and then walk-directory foo, it walks into the symlinked directory and finds its files like I would expect
22:48:55
NotThatRPG
If I recall correctly (and I could be wrong), there is no way to tell CCL *not* to follow the symlinks.
22:50:44
NotThatRPG
Yes, and I think there are ways that aggressively following symlinks can cause a mess in some ASDF link farms.
22:53:11
pve
ok, I see now.. well if it makes a difference, cl:directory in my ccl version does have a :follow-symlinks keyword parameter