libera/#clim - IRC Chatlog

5:20:49 jackdaniel no worries

9:48:03 metsomedog For drawing images ("tiles") in a grid, is there some built-in mcclim class recommended to use?

10:04:27 Brucio-61 do you mean using CLIM drawing routines for things lines and circles do draw images that are arranged in a grid or do you mean drawing existing bitmap images at grid-based positions?

10:05:42 metsomedog Hmm, I was thinking to load some images, and draw equally sized images in a grid for a simple 2d game.

10:22:09 Brucio-61 using bitmap images like this is called "patterns" in CLIM. see http://bauhh.dyndns.org:8000/clim-spec/E-2.html#_1968 for constructing patterns from bitmap files

10:23:04 Brucio-61 6DRAW-PATTERN draws such a pattern to a medium (http://bauhh.dyndns.org:8000/clim-spec/14-5.html#_749)

10:23:46 Brucio-61 sorry, 6DRAW-DESIGN or 6DRAW-PATTERN* do that

10:28:13 metsomedog Thanks I will have a look at those references and try getting something to render

10:30:50 Brucio-61 sure. good luck

10:45:16 jackdaniel metsomedog: as Brucio-61 said patterns represent images, and rectangular-tile is a class that represents a pattern that repeats itself

10:47:34 metsomedog What is a suitable "medium" for drawing onto? I'm trying to use clim-stream-pane right now

10:47:52 jackdaniel yes, clim-stream-pane is the abstraction you are looking for

10:49:31 metsomedog "(:panes

10:49:31 metsomedog (drawboard 'clim-stream-pane :height 600 :width 1920 :name 'drawboard)

10:49:31 metsomedog (interactor :interactor :scroll-bar nil))" leads to error "The value of CLIM-INTERNALS::PANE-TYPE is 'CLIM:CLIM-STREAM-PANE, which is not of type SYMBOL."

10:49:49 jackdaniel don't quote it

10:51:47 metsomedog Nice, successfully managed to load a png into the "drawboard" pane

10:52:45 metsomedog I found some opticl extension in bitmaps.lisp while grepping, any reason to use this over e.g. make-pattern-from-bitmap-file?

10:55:12 jackdaniel no

10:55:24 jackdaniel make-pattern-from-bitmap-file will internally use opticl if it must

10:55:30 jackdaniel so you lose nothing

10:56:47 metsomedog ok

11:03:11 jackdaniel so here goes 3h of my morning

11:03:31 jackdaniel the system update broke my display server and I had to play a detective with broken nvidia kernel modules

11:03:41 jackdaniel the good news is that it works now

11:04:36 metsomedog this is why i will never buy nvidia (tho i have had my fair share of crashes in amdgpu as well)

11:05:13 jackdaniel the necessity to package it weirdly is for sure nvidia fault

11:05:27 jackdaniel but it is tumbleweed packagers who messed up

11:05:38 jackdaniel I had to install upstream nvidia drivers manually, then all worked fine

11:13:20 metsomedog how should I "downscale" the image in make-pattern-from-bitmap-file/draw-design (say image is 800x600 and I want 80x60), and how should I draw it at some coordinate?

11:14:15 jackdaniel principially you should use transform-region, but I think that a method for patterns is not implemented (but try it!)

11:14:27 jackdaniel as of how to draw at a certain coordinate: use the function draw-pattern

11:14:40 jackdaniel draw-pattern*

11:16:18 jackdaniel even if transform-region works I'd still recommend scaling the image manually with a program that knows anything about downscaling - there are many algorithms and some of them are better and some of them are worse

11:16:26 jackdaniel naive downscaling is probably in the latter group :)

11:17:19 jackdaniel metsomedog: what kind of game are you working on?

11:17:57 metsomedog I'm testing mcclim vs sdl2 bindings for a simple roguelike game, basically never did graphics programming before so both are equally confusing

11:18:20 jackdaniel I see, good luck then

11:19:17 metsomedog Thanks, good that people are so helpful in IRC

11:46:54 metsomedog jackdaniel: if I have a huge tileset .png file with 12x12 sprites, is there some simple way to load some sprites from that file as "patterns"?

11:52:03 jackdaniel short of copying these sprites I can't think of anything in CLIM that'd help you with that

11:53:05 jackdaniel conformally displaced arrays would come handy

11:53:30 jackdaniel but sadly common lisp standard does not specify such a specimen (although ecl will have in the next release)

11:53:41 metsomedog So I should export them to separate files using another application? I would think you could say "load this subset of pixels from the image into a variable" sort of thing?

11:53:56 Brucio-61 there is a (i think unexported) way of making patterns from arrays of pixel data, though. so if you can load the whole tileset as an array and make "slices" yourself, you should be able to make the patterns in question

11:54:09 metsomedog Yes that should work

11:54:20 jackdaniel metsomedog: I mean that you could copy slices of the big array into smaller arrays

11:54:25 jackdaniel and constructs patterns from the latter

11:54:59 metsomedog make-pattern-from-bitmap-file on the top-level png file and then slice afterwards?

11:55:39 jackdaniel yeah. that wouldn't be like super portable (because you'll need to access the underlying pattern array)

11:55:45 jackdaniel but that should do the job

11:56:10 metsomedog portable as in portable across mcclim backends, or how do you mean?

11:56:23 jackdaniel portable across different clim implementations

11:58:29 jackdaniel for mcclim it should work just fine

11:58:54 metsomedog so that would be the array from %rgba-pattern I guess, where each index corresponds to 1 pixel?

11:59:15 jackdaniel yes

11:59:19 metsomedog ah right, I'm not going to use another clim backend than mcclim

12:00:16 jackdaniel CLIM is a specification, McCLIM is an implementation (like for example common lisp and sbcl), backend is local to the implementation

12:00:56 metsomedog yep, but I guess the only other clim implementations are from commercial lisps?

12:01:27 jackdaniel franz opensourced their implementation a few years back (see the topic)

12:01:56 jackdaniel but unless I'm horribly mistaken commercial vendors keep clim around to support existing clients, they are not doing anything new with it

12:02:11 jackdaniel lispworks pivoted to capi, and allegro use common-graphics (I think)

12:02:30 metsomedog as far as I can see mcclim is the only one being actively developed and extended

12:02:38 jackdaniel yes, that's my impression too

12:03:32 Brucio-61 another open source CLIM implementation is being developed by gilberth. it is unpublished as of now

12:03:41 jackdaniel how is it an open source then?

12:04:21 jackdaniel metsomedog: you may use the function clime:pattern-array to acces the array of the pattern

12:04:36 Brucio-61 once released, but you are right, that makes it not open source at this time, i guess

12:05:30 jackdaniel metsomedog: and (make-instance 'clime:image-pattern :array new-array)

12:06:06 jackdaniel perhaps we should change clim:make-pattern to create an image pattern when the argument DESIGNS is NIL

12:07:39 metsomedog Nice, that's better on the eyes than using slot-value ^^