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0:26:40
jasom
Xach: here's my current workaround; an awk script that calculates sha256 sums for each package: http://paste.lisp.org/+7L8Q
0:28:10
jasom
Xach: I then overwrite releases.txt and rebuild the cdb... nothing broke, and it met me use those sums in my script
0:47:54
slyrus
Fare: yeah, I know people _used_ to use it. But it seems like some things are broken now and I'm wondering if it's just me.
0:48:36
slyrus
I put closure-common up the sharplisper's github page. maybe we need to do the same for cxml and cxml-rng.
0:49:56
Fare
the following projects were unresponsive and had no github repo: bknr-web cl-blapack cxml-rng jwacs madeira-port org-sampler s-dot
0:52:21
Fare
if sharplispers take over some or all of these projects, I'll gladly send a PR. Or I can put the diffs in a repo of its own.
0:56:29
Fare
I decided to jump ship from CL. Too many things I missed from a modern Lisp. And those things I miss from CL (mainly, CLOS), I can reimplement on top of Gerbil when the time comes.
1:00:39
axion
Fare: Does that mean Racket was not as good as your recent post suggested? I've never heard of Gerbil.
1:07:24
Fare
2- it does implement a variant of the Racket module system, the most valuable part of Racket.
1:07:44
Fare
3- though it has fewer libraries, they are more consistent, being implemented by one man
1:08:06
Fare
4- it sits on top of Gambit, which is efficient and very suited to backend work, like I do
1:08:22
axion
Yeah. I actually spent a week learning Racket after reading your post, and I found it a little too complex for my liking.
1:09:42
Fare
5- Gambit has a very portable VM, the GVM, that provides interruptability and observability at the GVM level, abstracting away what's below. Which means that to achieve observability for the entire system (which would yield Erlang-style killability, among other things), I "only" have to work on top of the GVM, not down to assembly level. That's a big win for my future plans.
1:10:31
Fare
whoman: can they kill their actors? I seriously doubt they can, or with big unenforceable restrictions
1:19:35
axion
3.1.5 is pretty much unusable for large directory trees, taking longer than I could care to wait, compared to about a second for CL-FAD
1:41:11
White_Flame
Xach: had talked about moving an executable image to another box, and continuing to run quicklisp there. Now, consider if there is no QL installation on that box, what will need to be done?
1:42:15
White_Flame
our model is to drop a binary onto a machine and go, but now with certain things needing more stuff out of quicklisp, there is no preexisting lisp or ql environment there at all for it to go from
1:43:38
White_Flame
yes, but then it's going to want to load new systems after launching the binary on a different box
1:44:21
White_Flame
I'm already using an executable. QL needs to load systems after that executable is deployed
1:52:56
aeth
pillton: I'm a big language proponent. So the language vs. library distinction will be different for me than for some.
2:06:20
aeth
whoman: You can deduce things from axioms, and you can establish things statistically. Good luck doing either in software engineering, though, if that's what you mean.
3:13:07
vtomole
wow top post: https://news.ycombinator.com/ maybe people are interested in lisp more than i thought ;)
3:50:19
axion
Does anyone know anyone else besides attila that maintains alexandria? Looks like he hasn't been on IRC in several weeks.
3:52:30
axion
ROTATE mentions that it returns a sequence of the same type, which to me implies that it does an implicit copy. It doesn't mention anything about destructive behavior. However (let ((x "hello")) (list x (alexandria:rotate x -1))) => ("elloh" "elloh"). I'm not sure what to make of that, heh.
4:15:58
White_Flame
what's the idiomatic way to invoke a function from a package that wasn't available at read-time? (eval (read-from-string "(foo:bar 1 2 3)")) ?
4:19:01
loke
If EVAL is part of the proposed solution, that solution is very likely wrong. Not guaranteed, but very likely.
4:29:49
White_Flame
yeah, eval is the most compact for specifying the package:symbol directly, but if you need to pass params it gets messy
4:31:01
beach
By doing find-package and find-symbol, you can probably emit better error messages as well.
4:32:01
White_Flame
eh, I think symbol-not-found conditions would be relatively similar in either, for this case
4:54:47
fiddlerwoaroof
where alist-plist is a function that turns an a-list into a p-list (e.g. ALEXANDRIA:ALIST-PLIST)
4:59:35
shka_
(reduce (lambda (prev next) (cons (car next) (cons (cdr next) prev))) '((a . b) (c . d)) :initial-value nil)
4:59:41
borei
(loop for arg in '((:width . 100) (:hight . 100)) collect (car arg) collect (cdr arg))
5:00:23
fiddlerwoaroof
vtomole: in what context? (return-from 'function-name) would work, if it's in the body of a function
5:00:39
loke
H4ns: My judgment is clouded by the fact that the APPEND solution is mine, so I will not argue that.
5:48:44
fiddlerwoaroof
H4ns: when writing my own json serializers, I'm I supposed to specialize YASON:ENCODE + YASON:ENCODE-SLOTS?
5:54:06
fiddlerwoaroof
It would be nice if YASON:ENCODE had a default method that just called YASON:ENCODE-OBJECT
7:14:07
jasom
someone Fare? was asking about my ql2nix script. It needs a lot of cleanup, but here it is in all of its ugliness: https://github.com/jasom/ql2nix
7:16:49
jasom
Fare: oh, I want to hear more about safe killing of actors; that's generally not possible without a lot of restrictions
7:42:16
H4ns
fiddlerwoaroof: yason is not really trying to be very convenient for the use case that you describe, serializers for types. i've specifically wanted to be able to tightly control the json output rather than be able to serialize arbitrary lisp objects to json. this is not to say that your suggestion does not make sense, but there may be json libraries that are better for what you're trying to do.
7:58:41
schweers
properly implementing lisp numbers and the comparison of strings to numbers on javascript sounds like a real pain
8:02:14
pjb
schweers: there's no comparison of string to number in CL, so it should not be painful at all.
8:02:35
pjb
(there's only EQ, EQL and EQUAL which could apply both on a string and a number, and the result would be obvious).
8:03:30
schweers
often one cannot tell at compiletime which types the variables will hold, so what happens if I have (= a b) and one of them is the number 0 and the other the empty string? in CL this would signal a condition (I think). In JS it should yield true, right?
8:07:37
schweers
I would have thought that runtime checks are needed to implement this behaviour, yet JSLisp tries to avoid those
8:09:23
pjb
Anyways, if you want my advice, don't implement CL in javascript. Implement a CL to javascript compiler in CL. Then use CL to compile this compiler, then use this compiler to compile itself, then you will have a CL to javascript compiler in javascript.
8:09:48
pjb
This way, you only have to deal with javascript as a target language, not as an implementation language.
8:20:29
axion
sigh, JSCL devs still haven't fixed my bug reported where it's possible to freeze the entire image
8:28:22
edgar-rft
axion: javascript folks would be totally unhappy if there's nothing freezing your browser frequently
10:13:22
attila_lendvai
he's eye'ing infrastructure work ala tunes.org where he doesn't want to waste too much time on the hw related details of a compiler
10:13:48
attila_lendvai
btw, that red language mentioned in the comments seems interesting based on 5 minutes of reading: http://www.red-lang.org/p/about.html
11:19:40
Fare
some-use`, interchangeable? No, I believe Gerbil is superior for what I'm doing right now.
11:24:28
Fare
jasom, herep -- yes I was asking about ql2nix. As for killing actors, see my recent rant on the gambit list (if you follow me on twitter: http://twitter.com/ngnghm )
11:42:32
PuercoPop
slyrus: There is an actively developed and mantained fork of cxml: https://github.com/TBRSS/FXML/
11:59:31
some-user
Fare: Sorry, got disconnected. But what are you doing right know if it's not a secret? Or at what task Gerbil is superior to CL?
12:15:54
Fare
Gerbil has actors and RPC builtin, and a decent story for DSLs (including Racket-like #lang)