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11:50:37
no-defun-allowed
It's low hanging fruit, but I think mentioning that you do not necessarily need 10gb of heap might encourage people to experiment and test out sicl more.
11:51:11
beach
no-defun-allowed: I'll wait with that until there is something worth experimenting with.
11:51:55
no-defun-allowed
I don't know much about compilers and much of what SICL covers, so I can only comment on the boring stuff.
11:53:19
beach
jcowan: When I give talks to industry, I actually give an alternative to using a programming language with an independent standard.
11:53:28
beach
jcowan: If they choose a different language and I see a proper risk analysis that includes the cost of maintaining an implementation of that language (in case existing implementation are abandoned, or the benevolent dictator decides to alter it in incompatible ways), then that means that they have planned for this eventuality and that they assume the risk.
11:54:27
beach
jcowan: And they just make very risky decisions anyway; decisions that might destroy the entire company if things go wrong.
11:56:20
jcowan
beach: In a climate in which people come up to you and stuff your pockets full of thousand-dollar bills merely for walking down the right street, such risk-taking is entirely rational.
11:57:00
no-defun-allowed
That's true, you could probably get venture funding if you sold toaster shoes.
11:57:22
no-defun-allowed
That doesn't mean you should expect it to continue that way, or that you should rely on it.
11:58:27
jcowan
Why not? The vast gains in productivity over the last 30 years have gone entirely to the rich, and even they can only buy so many yachts with it. The rest has to be recycled somehow.
11:59:43
jcowan
The need is to get something working quickly, and for that you don't want any more architecture than is required to construct a termite mound.
12:01:52
jcowan
Believe me, I hate the corruption of programming-as-a-discipline as much as you do, perhaps more.
12:02:21
jcowan
It's still important to be right, it's just not important to have already been right.
12:02:47
no-defun-allowed
#sicl trashtalk actually has valid arguments with inciteful points, unlike certain cafes where saying people who are there should be shot is okay.
12:04:18
no-defun-allowed
Anyways, erm, people still get money for bad ideas cause there's a way to monetise them no one else expected. Selling user data is a great one.
12:05:18
no-defun-allowed
Anyways again, I look forward to pressing M-. a lot over the weekend on SICL.
13:23:30
beach
frodef: I don't remember the details, but it was clear from when you described your objectives, they were very different from what you see in that document.
14:24:11
beach
OK, it is getting close to the end of the day and the end of the week. Soon, fatigue will prevent me from doing any more serious work today.
14:24:17
beach
I made some progress on bootstrapping, but there is not much to show for it. I am still trying to eliminate a special version of ADD-METHOD in favor of the production version in phase 3.
14:24:25
beach
When I do that, the production version invalidates the discriminating function (as it should).
14:24:26
beach
But then, when a new discriminating function must be calculated, I have some mysterious classes appear. I am getting closer to figuring out why, though.