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18:12:12
alandipert
do any emacs users know if it's possible to specify the lisp-mode syntax of def* forms introduced in a Lisp file, using file-local variables or similar mechanism?
18:15:55
alandipert
Xach thanks, i'm in the same boat. i found https://stackoverflow.com/a/4356877 but involves Eval:
18:17:27
alandipert
although hm, looks like trivial-indent is a SLIME thing, and i'm not using SLIME
18:24:47
splittist
Which highly obvious library translated from html entities to (nonstandard) lisp characters?
18:26:41
Colleen
Function plump-dom:decode-entities https://shinmera.github.io/plump#FUNCTION%20PLUMP-DOM%3ADECODE-ENTITIES
18:32:30
Xach
Shinmera: did you see the error in http://report.quicklisp.org/2020-02-24/failure-report/cl-steamworks.html#cl-steamworks ?
19:05:27
Xach
I want to reach out to David Psenicka about FOMUS's inability to build, but i can't find any recent contact info.
19:05:41
sjl_
Xach: question about quicklisp: since bitbucket is ending Mercurial support I've moved my repos to my own self-hosted location. What's the easiest way for me to get the new URLs into quicklisp-projects? Open tickets for each project? Open one big ticket? PR quicklisp-projects myself?
19:20:22
d4ryus
alandipert: You can also put a property with the 'def*' name into [common-]lisp-indent-function, for example in your .dir-locals.el: (eval . (put 'define-something 'lisp-indent-function 2)) => define-something has 2 arguments, followed by the 'body'
19:22:35
d4ryus
alandipert: haven't seen it much on common-lisp projects, but most guile projects often use them, for example guile itself: http://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/guile.git/tree/.dir-locals.el , works with any lisp tho :)
19:31:07
edgar-rft
Xach: people using the old CL versions of Common Music, FOMUS, etc can be found on the cmdist@ccrma.Stanford.EDU mailing list
19:39:04
developernotes
Earlier this month I had posted about the idea of a state of Common Lisp survey for 2020 on reddit. I received positive feedback on the idea.
19:39:35
developernotes
I have posted an update on reddit here for the survey: https://www.reddit.com/r/Common_Lisp/comments/f8wqkj/state_of_common_lisp_survey_2020/
20:17:44
jackdaniel
I remember I've seen a presentation about using KCL to write a game a few years back on some old console (commercial setting), but it was too slow, so they were transpiling source and then modifying it by hand
20:18:05
jackdaniel
anyone remembers something like this? even better - does anyone have a link to this presentation?
20:19:30
developernotes
Odin-: I used this as the source for license names: https://opensource.org/licenses/alphabetical
20:23:24
Odin-
developernotes: https://spdx.org/licenses/ is more exhaustive, although I suspect it'd be best to have free-form text there.
20:44:17
develope1notes
Odin-: thanks, I've added CC0 and WTFPL to the list. I can adjust the overall list for next year.
21:27:13
no-defun-allowed
Sorry to effectively repeat what was said half an hour ago, but the Cooperative Software License isn't on the list and that's what I've been using for my last few serious projects.
21:30:58
no-defun-allowed
But that's used by exactly 4 projects on GitHub, so it's probably not statistics-worthy.
21:47:44
Odin-
It's a recurrent theme, trying to use licencing to accomplish goals that sit completely outside of what licencing meaningfully can do.
21:49:24
no-defun-allowed
Yes, I heard that a few licenses can't actually be held, for some reason that I forgot, but probably relates to copyright law.
21:51:38
no-defun-allowed
In my opinion, they're still much less "out there" than many EULAs for commercial software products, but the publishers of those know lawyers and I don't.
21:51:49
Odin-
Dunno, the main issue I see here is that "commercial purposes" is differently defined in various jurisdictions.
21:52:21
Odin-
The local reading here would, for instance, prohibit the use of the software in fundraising for a union.
21:53:48
z147
creative commons goes over the issues with defining commercial https://wiki.creativecommons.org/wiki/NonCommercial_interpretation
21:54:13
no-defun-allowed
It would be ironic for a union to not be a "worker-owned collective", which is explicitly allowed in the license. Maybe that needs definition, too.
21:55:02
Bike
i dig the boldface "we're not trying to be lawyers, please don't kill us bar associations" warnings
21:55:03
z147
For example, US government giving private contractors access to software licensed under non-commercial could be seen as non-commercial, etc etc
21:55:19
splittist
If the energy programmers spent on thinking and arguing about software licences was spent on programming...
21:55:20
Odin-
no-defun-allowed: Unions are generally not 'worker-owned' but some form of "self-owned".
21:58:00
Odin-
splittist: There'd just be something else to argue over. Editors and OS choice, and so on.
22:02:23
stylewarning
anybody have info/tips on running Lisp subprocesses/fork/etc? I don't mean shelling out.
22:11:36
stylewarning
i was hoping there'd be a nice interface out there for managing child processes and the like
22:12:52
White_Flame
there are libs for non-forked process management, I think UIOP contains some of that, and some trivial-*
22:16:26
White_Flame
I have no idea what devils lie in the details of the interaction between fork and ffi
22:17:25
Odin-
I would expect to tread carefully, because Common Lisp really doesn't make many concessions to the process model.
22:18:02
iAmDecim
so quick question. i've definitely had slime working on my macbook before. I just recently tried to start up a repl and I added (load "~/quicklisp/setup.lisp") to my init.el file and it's giving me void-function defpackage
22:18:52
White_Flame
that setup.lisp is for your common lisp startup (eg .sbclrc). it's not emacs lisp
22:19:24
White_Flame
there are quicklisp helpers to install all that for you; you shouldn't have to do it manually
22:19:58
iAmDecim
oh....ok. i took a wrong path. i'll go back. I know years ago I had to add something funny to give it the path. time to do some pruning
22:20:58
White_Flame
"The function ql:add-to-init-file will add code to do this to your init file automatically, so Quicklisp will load whenever your Common Lisp session starts."
22:27:42
jmercouris
what's a good way to capture stdout/stderror from a program not launched via terminal?
22:33:52
White_Flame
iAmDecim: slime-helper is when you get your lisp implementation, then quicklisp, then let ql install slime. If you already have slime, then you don't need the slime helper
22:53:17
pjb
minion: memo for jmercouris: stdout/stderr are directed to the same file descriptor as the parent process. So, what does the parent process do to them? (It may redirect them to /dev/null). Inside the child, you can reopen or dup them. What do you want to do?
23:01:18
iAmDecim
ok it's at least running but has anyone seen these warnings? https://pastebin.com/3cDZeUXu
23:06:08
iAmDecim
White_Flame: ahh..I bet I am. Checking...I just tried to reinstall slime since it's been years.
23:08:04
White_Flame
because there are some sb-fm internals that aren't matching, and you're running a newer sbcl version, there's probably an old version of slime
23:10:20
iAmDecim
yeah. i reinstalled slime. Restarting emacs just cut out a large portion of the errors...there's still one block. https://pastebin.com/HYRp0emK
23:11:02
iAmDecim
oh i see what you mean now....ok i'll play with that later. i bet i did install sbcl with brew and an older method.
23:11:23
iAmDecim
I'll play with this tonight. I really need to clean things up anyways on this laptop
23:35:48
amnesia1010
https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSfg7UJRKrkI3OjOHWL4xI-murE4LpQjIxsiAhFdPEmtyLX3kg/viewform