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19:44:15
_death
characters also can be compared using EQL, which many operators use as default for comparison
19:49:42
jasom
_death: at least in most lisp implementations it's more obviously wrong to compare strings with EQL than the python equivalent (python interns strings that are valid identifiers under a certain length, so comparing with "is" sometimes works and sometimes doesn't)
19:58:28
_death
jasom: on the other hand the default python comparison operator would "work" with strings
21:09:52
Xach
copec: both - this isn't a good place to center a discussion about what is happening with racket
21:10:07
Xach
but i get the impression that few people here keep up with racket and could talk about it in a CL-centric way
21:10:52
copec
I'm not switching from my own CL use. I'm just interesting in thinking about and comparing what other languages do
21:14:44
aeth
##lisp is for the Lisp family of languages so you might get a better/fairer comparison than #lisp or #racket would give you.
21:30:09
jasom
copec: FWIW, something like #lang could be implemented on top of CL's reader macros, and it would be interesting to see.
21:49:25
phoe
postmodern is still alive and kicking, I remember contributing to it earlier this year
21:49:38
stylewarning
Shinmera: because postgres has been through 3 major version upgrades since 2012
21:51:10
stylewarning
Shinmera: I doubt it would, especially being a database, but the spookiest of things can happen in 8 years. (:
21:52:18
Shinmera
postmodern alone is why I would recommend CL people to use postgres over any other rdbms
21:52:52
pjb
stylewarning: I don't know about postmodern. I know that I need to patch pg to be able to run with postgresql 9.6, 10 or 11…
23:24:29
didi
I just noticed `defpackage' separates each option in lists, but `defsystem' doesn't. Coincidence?
23:28:33
pjb
(defmacro defsystem (name &key description author maintainer licence version proeprties depends-on …) …)
0:18:24
jasom
We were talking about qt5 bindings. The Go QT bindings has a tool that auto-generates extern "C" functions for everything in QT. They can't be used directly though because all callbacks are in autogenerated go files that export a C header through cgo. However, that could be used as a basis for a lisp qt5 generator certainly.
1:03:39
jasom
p_l: which Qt5 bindings use libclang to generate the interface? Most of the bindings seemed to be quick/QML only.
6:37:22
beach
Me? I'm doing fine. Progress is slow but steady. But I don't think that what I do is representative for #lisp.
6:42:27
elderK
I'm not quite sure how things are. They could be a lot worse, so at least there's that.
6:47:19
drmeister
Damn - ASDF appears to require fasl files to be files and doesn't allow them to be directories.
6:48:13
beach
ck_: A lot of discussion about which of several GUI libraries written in C or C++ to choose, is another.
6:48:22
elderK
beach: The problem might be with me. I'm not sure yet. I actually came here to ask advice: What have you guys done in the past when you needed to talk to like, I guess what you'd call an older-role-model. Someone who knows you, but isn't *too* close to you. Someone who's opinion you can trust, without it be influenced by the stuff you're talking about? You might say, talk to a senior colleague. That was my
6:48:23
elderK
first idea, but I haven't yet established strong enough connections with my colleagues to make that sufficiently safe.
6:49:19
ck_
beach: oh, the last point I hadn't witnessed yet. But you make it sound quite bleak in general.
6:52:39
beach
elderK: That seems quite off topic. Maybe try #lispcafe. I don't go there myself because I don't have time for random chat.
6:54:08
beach
ck_: But as I realized a few weeks ago, it's a perfect example of the prisoners dilemma.
6:56:41
beach
ck_: Ideally, Lispers should collaborate to fill the gaps in our collection of libraries and applications, but instead, everyone prefers to work on an immediate individual problem that needs to be solved. As a result, the collective effort is much higher than it could be.
6:59:58
ck_
I meant that as an attempt to nudge the focus towards doing that again. I know this channel isn't fertile ground for that, but one can hope.
7:01:34
fe[nl]ix
drmeister: you're better off going the JVM route: make your fasl a zip-encoded file which you can treat as a virtual file-system
7:03:48
drmeister
Could I generate a fasl inside of a zip-encoded file and then run dsymutil on it to generate a .dwarf file that also goes into the zip-encoded file?
7:07:01
lukego
Xach: Yeah clbuild. I think that worked as an "executable problem statement" i.e. a really quick and easy way to confirm that the latest version of everything is broken and incompatible. In those days I'd regularly "sit down to try some McCLIM hacking" and several hours later still be fighting with installation problems. Quicklisp is a hell of a better experience B)
7:07:26
drmeister
Yeah - and I get it. We talked about zip files. We thought directories would be less trouble. Now I'm not so sure.
7:08:31
fe[nl]ix
have compile-file output various intermediate files to a temp directory, call dsymutil, then package verything up in a zip fasl
7:08:53
drmeister
We are having a problem with multiple processes compiling the same asdf systems and clobbering each others builds. We need fasl generation to be atomic - so we are going to use rename-file as the atomic operation.
7:09:09
drmeister
The problem on macOS is building the fasl and debug info is two steps, not atomic.
7:10:26
fe[nl]ix
of course, as long as each compile-file a) creates a uniquely named temp dir b) creates the fasl in there and c) commits this "transaction" by an atomic rename-file
7:12:02
fe[nl]ix
if you do things right and ensure page-level alignment, you could even mmap directly from the zip file
7:12:07
drmeister
Sorry - I'm a bit disgusted at the moment. It's not just this - we found a bug in ld64 that is causing us grief with our compile-file-parallel.