freenode/#lisp - IRC Chatlog
Search
6:07:41
yoeljacobsen
Is there a way to see every bound variables in SLDB with SBCL (like CCL's default behavior when entering a frame)?
6:27:00
Shinmera
yoeljacobsen: If they're not there they have been optimised out. You can try compiling your function with debug 3 (C-u C-c C-c) to retain them, but if they're not used at all they still won't show up even then.
6:54:06
nwoob
Not exactly a lisp question but I want to seek some guidance. I am not a smart person, i can't come up to solutions quickly. So what can I do to become a good programmer like people here
6:57:42
nwoob
So it is possible to counted as a good programmer even when a person is not smart to be start with
6:59:25
nwoob
I read all those fairy tales like stuff about lisp that it is magical and will open your mind and all that stuff, maybe I'm looking at it wrong
7:00:43
Shinmera
Lisp offers different perspectives on writing programs. These perspectives can be valuable and useful to building good software.
7:01:24
Shinmera
There's plenty of languages out there that are very different, and each come with their own perspectives. Ideally you learn them all.
7:15:45
beach
nwoob: His research shows that expertise is the result of hard work and not of any sort of intrinsic concept of intelligence.
7:30:35
scymtym
when i install screamer via quicklisp, i get screamer-20190710-git. however, looking at https://github.com/quicklisp/quicklisp-projects/blob/master/projects/screamer/source.txt and https://github.com/nikodemus/screamer , it seems the most recent change was in 2015. does anybody know why that is?
8:06:30
leedleLoo
I recently read richard gabriel's paper here where he distinguishes between languages and systems: https://www.dreamsongs.com/Files/Incommensurability.pdf. Is there other reading making this distinction? When folks have asked why I prefer CL, especially over other lisps, I've always pointed out that the environment exposed through lisp/slime is unparalleled and I feel that the paper kinda touches on this
8:18:21
Lycurgus
u need to set the heap size it won't grow beyond the configed limit, though the hang being a loop is suspect
9:09:12
leedleLoo
beach: I'm not sure which section in the wiki is relevant to the lang vs system distinction
9:12:56
beach
leedleLoo: A language is "just" a (usually infinite) set of phrases. By "system", I assume that Gabriel meant some kind of software.
9:14:04
schweers
As I have no idea what portacle does, I’m afraid I can’t tell you where portacle gets its configuration. Does it start an emacs instance?
9:24:24
leedleLoo
beach: Gabriel defined his use of Language and System on page 11 of the paper. I'm still not sure what part of wikipedia is relevant, though
9:41:44
_death
leedleLoo: maybe you'll be interested in http://www.nhplace.com/kent/PS/Hindsight.html
9:49:08
leedleLoo
_death: I skimmed over the headings and will read later on, but this is great, thanks :)
9:52:04
_death
it doesn't go too deep, just the first thing that occurred to me in relation to the RPG paper
10:02:20
schweers
seok: That’s weird. I use the same variable to set my heap size and it works just fine. I don’t use portacle though.
10:05:28
leedleLoo
The page seems to focus on the repl-experience instead of just talking about the language itself, and that's what I was interested in. I've always felt that folks comparing CL to other languages/lisps have tended to focus on the language and the not development experience as a whole
10:23:59
_death
leedleLoo: correct.. there are other communities also taking the system view seriously, such as the Smalltalk community..
10:27:51
leedleLoo
_death: I haven't really dabbled in Smalltalk myself, but from what I've read, that's absolutely true. I haven't seen other communities with this viewpoint though, and it's really the main reason why I write CL
10:33:59
_death
leedleLoo: I found it interesting that the target paper critiqued by RPG was written by a Smalltalk guy
10:56:15
Shinmera
seok: .emacs does not apply to Portacle. Use user.el in the config/ directory instead.
11:09:26
thijso
_death: that hindsight link seems to touch on quite a few things in common with PAIP, which I'm reading through for the first time now
11:11:10
thijso
can't say I'm able to follow all of it on first read, though... info density is quite high
11:15:58
thijso
I'm afraid it'll be a bit like physics in high school... you follow the explanation during class, and think, oh right, I understand that... then, when you need to figure out the stuff yourself during a test, you're totally lost and unable to make the leap from problem to solution...
11:16:52
thijso
Yeah... I'm skipping those on the first read through... have to save something for later, right?
11:19:29
_death
it's not a critical one anyway.. before or after matters less as long as at some point you get some practice
13:12:39
beach
Since many people here hang out neither in #sicl nor in #clim, let me just encourage anyone who regularly uses an inspector during development to try the new version of Clouseau. I am currently using its extension API in order to inspect SICL bootstrapping objects, something that was not possible with the old Clouseau. The new version is a total rewrite (by scymtym) and I thing he did a fantastic job.
13:30:24
yoeljacobsen
beach - I couldn't find much info on Clouseau - may you please provide more information on how to try it?
13:37:52
edgar-rft
yoeljacobsen: don't thank me too early, the link leads to a ten year old version :-(
13:38:48
scymtym
i updated the wiki page to link to the current source (i.e. https://github.com/McCLIM/McCLIM/tree/master/Apps/Clouseau ). the documentation is here: https://common-lisp.net/project/mcclim/static/manual/mcclim.html#Inspector