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21:49:52
aeth
vms14: You are writing a function that writes HTML strings when given HTML in s-expression form, so that's all it should do (I kind of break this rule myself to allow support for some very simple things, but that's mainly because I couldn't find a better way to do it)
21:50:08
aeth
vms14: So you shouldn't be thinking about "so for :color red I should have a class .red and create it if not exists"
21:51:29
aeth
vms14: Yes, but you will probably never finish if you make your functions do too many things at once... if you make them too smart.
21:52:52
aeth
vms14: JS is much harder than the rest, and isn't really critical for the basic task, so you should ignore that for now. And when you do write JS, you should write JS in a direct s-expression representation of JS, rather than trying to do anything fancy, because it's much easier to do fancy things as s-expression->s-expression
21:56:56
aeth
vms14: Anyway, no matter how much you hate the source language and think that it can be improved upon, you can't do that in the function that calls FORMAT because then you'll add too much logic by the time you're done. What you'll want to eventually do is (generate-html (c (b (a your-awesome-language))) buffer)
22:02:05
vms14
the problem is the only way to have a lisp language instead of html+css is making a transpiler
22:04:50
aeth
vms14: Yes, but you were looking at the s-expression problem incorrectly. If you use the syntax (foo (:bar 42) "Hello!") then there are only two cases at the top level. Either it is a list or it is not a list. If it is not a list, then it's in the body and should be an escaped string (to escape stuff like <). If it is in a list, then it has the regular structure (destructuring-bind (tag attribute-plist &body body) item ...)
22:06:05
aeth
In all recursive calls, pass format-destination even though you want to make it a keyword argument and optional for the caller. Then, you don't need *buffer* as a global, since buffer is passed each time
22:07:56
vms14
then how would be your syntax for a lisp language like (title "hi" :color "red" :onclick #'dosomething)
22:10:06
aeth
vms14: That's a separate problem. There, you turn (title "hi" :color "red" :onclick #'dosomething) into (title (:color "red" :onclick "dosomething()") "hi") which is regular and simple and known, and can then be written by the writing function that I described
22:16:47
aeth
vms14: you don't even need to do the writing function if what you really want to do is the fancy part, since the writing function has been done a dozen times before (sometimes with the syntax (:foo :key "value" "body1" "body2") and sometimes with the syntax (:foo (:key "value") "body1" "body2") and sometimes with other syntax, but none of that matters if you're processing it anyway)
22:17:47
aeth
the writing part isn't as easy as it seems because you have to escape <, >, and &, and if in an attribute you also have to escape "
22:35:08
thijso
Shinmera: looks interesting, but it's way past my bedtime here. I'll try to remember to look at it tomorrow. Or remind me...
23:01:13
no-defun-allowed
w.r.t update-instance-for-redefined-class, if I redefine a class A to A', then A' to A'', does the function have to be called twice or can the function "jump" from A to A''?
23:13:35
Bike
"Updating such an instance occurs at an implementation-dependent time, but no later than the next time a slot of that instance is read or written."
6:07:41
yoeljacobsen
Is there a way to see every bound variables in SLDB with SBCL (like CCL's default behavior when entering a frame)?
6:27:00
Shinmera
yoeljacobsen: If they're not there they have been optimised out. You can try compiling your function with debug 3 (C-u C-c C-c) to retain them, but if they're not used at all they still won't show up even then.
6:54:06
nwoob
Not exactly a lisp question but I want to seek some guidance. I am not a smart person, i can't come up to solutions quickly. So what can I do to become a good programmer like people here
6:57:42
nwoob
So it is possible to counted as a good programmer even when a person is not smart to be start with
6:59:25
nwoob
I read all those fairy tales like stuff about lisp that it is magical and will open your mind and all that stuff, maybe I'm looking at it wrong
7:00:43
Shinmera
Lisp offers different perspectives on writing programs. These perspectives can be valuable and useful to building good software.
7:01:24
Shinmera
There's plenty of languages out there that are very different, and each come with their own perspectives. Ideally you learn them all.
7:15:45
beach
nwoob: His research shows that expertise is the result of hard work and not of any sort of intrinsic concept of intelligence.
7:30:35
scymtym
when i install screamer via quicklisp, i get screamer-20190710-git. however, looking at https://github.com/quicklisp/quicklisp-projects/blob/master/projects/screamer/source.txt and https://github.com/nikodemus/screamer , it seems the most recent change was in 2015. does anybody know why that is?
8:06:30
leedleLoo
I recently read richard gabriel's paper here where he distinguishes between languages and systems: https://www.dreamsongs.com/Files/Incommensurability.pdf. Is there other reading making this distinction? When folks have asked why I prefer CL, especially over other lisps, I've always pointed out that the environment exposed through lisp/slime is unparalleled and I feel that the paper kinda touches on this
8:18:21
Lycurgus
u need to set the heap size it won't grow beyond the configed limit, though the hang being a loop is suspect
9:09:12
leedleLoo
beach: I'm not sure which section in the wiki is relevant to the lang vs system distinction
9:12:56
beach
leedleLoo: A language is "just" a (usually infinite) set of phrases. By "system", I assume that Gabriel meant some kind of software.
9:14:04
schweers
As I have no idea what portacle does, I’m afraid I can’t tell you where portacle gets its configuration. Does it start an emacs instance?
9:24:24
leedleLoo
beach: Gabriel defined his use of Language and System on page 11 of the paper. I'm still not sure what part of wikipedia is relevant, though
9:41:44
_death
leedleLoo: maybe you'll be interested in http://www.nhplace.com/kent/PS/Hindsight.html