12:54:02jackdaniel(however a blinking cursor is a text style applied to a text, not a redraw)
13:41:51mseddonXach: Oh! you can do borland style interfaces now- there are unicode characters for the old VGA codepage so you can get all the trimmings.
13:43:47jackdanielunicode characters in terminal emulators are unreliable at best
13:44:22jackdaniel(i.e they consume more space than one cell but less than two cells and stuff like that)
13:44:33mseddonthey're not great, I admit. and UTF-8 is fun
13:45:30mseddonplus also terminals themselves are rather unreliable, performance wise.
13:45:45mseddonsome are very fast, some are embarrassingly janky.
13:46:25mseddonbut hey. Borland with poop emoji icons. What's not to love? :)
16:34:17jmercouris_IIT is my nemesis, I went to IIT in the US :-)
16:34:26jmercouris_always taking google search results :-D
16:35:01saganmanI don't know how much lisp I remember
16:35:13beachsaganman: Careful, though. When I was teaching undergraduates, I found that it was easier to teach programming to those who had never programmed before. Those who had already programmed had often acquired bad habits that might work for small programs but not for large ones.
16:35:18saganmanlast time I used it to solve project euler problems
16:35:26beachAnd it was hard to make them change their habits.
16:35:39saganmanbeach: this is my second bachelors
16:39:00madnificentbeach: fully agree. bad experience often leads to unexpected twists.
16:40:55contrapunctussaganman: oh, hello from Delhi 😀
16:41:00beachWe called them "cowboy programmers" (they were typically all male). They would always be convinced that we were talking BS, because they had a very long experience, so they obviously knew better. Needless to say, they were unhappy when we gave them bad grades.
16:42:44beachAnswer: "A working program that is not maintainable is worthless because it can't be fixed, but a non-working program that is maintainable can easily be fixed to work."
16:42:55madnificentthough I can imagine it is hard to convince them though. we got a course at some point indicating changes to a project. that helped make clear why good design matters. it is a lengthy lesson.
16:43:08beach"because it can't evolve" is what I meant to say.
16:43:21mseddonrule 1 of code entropy: your program is breaking, and gaining bugs, because the environment it runs in is changing. You don't have to do anything, it is already melting.
20:47:44alanzphoe, is that related to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anaphoric_macro#Defining_anaphoric_macros (which I happened to come across today)
20:48:53phoealanz: hmmmm, I actually don't think so
20:49:41alanzjust happen to be doing something vaguely similar, in refering to a self-referential function. The second example. Many ways to skin a cat, I suppose
22:28:44phoebut, I guess, if you make a git repository with a *ton* of submodules and slap a trivial-bodge.asd on top...
22:28:45borodusti wonder if dist merging could be a thing
22:29:00aethphoe: ASDF works on systems, QL works on projects, and they're not the same... annoying projects like CL-SDL2 that use systems like SDL2 break that assumption. (And even if that assumption held, there are lots of secondary systems)
22:31:20aethThe goal of trivial-bodge would be to load every bodge project, but not necessarily every bodge system (since e.g. some might just be for tests... although at the moment every bodge-* project in Quicklisp has one system, of the same name)