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Sunday, 11th of March 2018, 6:05:18 UTC
6:08:48
JuanDaugherty
ACTION doesn't know of anything like a common semantic thing for lisp as such other than the usual inclusion of a prolog implementation
6:09:58
fouric
Is there an easy way of getting CFFI to print a list of search paths after it explodes because it could not find a shared library?
6:11:00
JuanDaugherty
isn't just inspecting the paths easier?
6:14:04
Fare
beach: which tones are confused in the south?
6:14:23
Fare
fouric: there's always a way
6:15:37
fouric
Fare: of course - I was just hoping for something easy, because otherwise I'll just start putting symlinks in /usr/lib or something
6:17:37
fouric
Wait, LD_LIBRARY_PATH is a thing.
6:18:01
fouric
Turns out that the CFFI documentation is actually pretty useful.
6:22:30
beach
Fare: ~ and ? are pronounced the same in the south.
6:22:52
beach
Fare: . is pronounced differently in the north and in the south.
6:24:13
beach
Fare: I mean ~ is pronounced in the south just like ? is pronounced both in the north and in the south.
6:24:41
fouric
beach: are you familiar with the Java concept of "interfaces"?
6:25:02
beach
Fare: Neither ~ nor . has a "glottal stop" in the south.
6:25:16
beach
fouric: Yes, it is a subset of what we call "protocols" in Common Lisp.
6:25:41
fouric
How correct would it be to call Cleavir a compiler "interface"?
6:25:58
fouric
Oh, I haven't heard of this concept (protocols) before.
6:26:05
fouric
Do you have something I could read?
6:26:23
fouric
(you could explain it here if you wanted, but if you have a good resource, no need to consume your time...)
6:26:31
beach
http://metamodular.com/protocol.pdf
6:26:39
fouric
Excellent. Thank you!
6:27:07
beach
fouric: Cleavir has a large collection of protocols. Such a collection is sometimes referred to as a "framework".
6:53:38
beach
patrixl: What about it?
6:56:05
patrixl
beach: sorry. my fingers have been having trouble typing properly today, and this time missed the whole /join part of that line..
6:57:42
patrixl
not as bad as that time I typed my nickserv password in a channel lol
7:00:20
patrixl
no 2FA AFAIK but I haven't been around for some years lol.
7:01:09
siraben
Is it possible to connect to freenode without registering?
7:01:24
beach
Let's try to stick to the topic a bit more this time, OK?
7:01:50
siraben
beach: What do you mean?
7:02:19
siraben
beach: Don't we always ;)
7:02:23
beach
The other day, you had a very long conversation completely unrelated to Common Lisp. Just reminding you about the topic.
7:02:35
siraben
Oh yeah, sorry about that
7:03:09
SaganMan
Shinmera: join #help
7:03:25
SaganMan
siraben: join #help
7:03:36
SaganMan
Shinmera: sorry, wrong highlight
7:05:19
st_iron
do i understand well that cons cells are just like single linked lists, and the car contains the value, the cdr the pointer to the next item?
7:05:38
st_iron
s/pointer/reference/
7:05:45
beach
st_iron: That is how CONS cells are often used, i.e. to build lists.
7:05:55
beach
st_iron: But, they can be used as pairs as well.
7:06:13
siraben
You can do circular lists in Common Lisp
7:06:21
st_iron
pairs? like (a . b)?
7:06:43
SaganMan
it's easy to do that
7:06:55
siraben
Are lists implemented with O(n) lookup time?
7:06:56
st_iron
understood, thank you very much, it's clear now
7:07:04
siraben
Would it be better to use hash tables or data lookup?
7:07:24
beach
siraben: Depends on the size. Yes, O(n).
7:08:20
siraben
Could you implement lists as only putting cars on top of each other?
7:08:42
beach
siraben: Sure, but then the language has no support for such lists.
7:09:08
beach
siraben: You would have to rewrite FIND, POSITION, MAPCAR, etc.
7:09:20
siraben
Would be an exercise I suppose
7:09:30
beach
Not a very useful one.
7:09:44
siraben
Are continuations in Common Lisp as well?
7:09:54
siraben
equivalent to call/cc
7:10:13
siraben
But you can write functions by CPS transform to add that, right?
7:11:22
st_iron
i study from Peter Seibel's book, he explains everything very well
7:11:40
beach
siraben: Sure you can transform to CPS, but you still don't have call/cc. Also, CPS pretty much requires tail-call optimization which the standard doesn't require.
7:11:47
st_iron
but sometimes the explanation confuses me :)
7:12:05
beach
st_iron: Then you come here and get clarification.
7:12:38
st_iron
beach: and i really appreciate it :) thanks
7:13:44
siraben
I wonder what an operating system built on Lisp would be like
7:13:47
siraben
Like the Lisp machines of the past
7:14:23
beach
siraben: Something like this I would imagine http://metamodular.com/lispos.pdf
7:17:31
beach
siraben: There is also Mezzano which is much more complete at this point.
7:17:43
beach
siraben: And Movitz, but it is no longer maintained.
7:26:06
Fare
passing your code thru a CPT is fine, but then all library code has to go thru the same CPT, or else
7:26:39
Fare
siraben, look at rust & such for OS on suitable languages
7:27:37
beach
siraben: Did you faint?
7:29:33
dorothyw
** NICK johnnymacs
9:00:57
jack_rabbit
asdf is giving me 'Component "package html-convert" not found' when trying to load one of my projects. html-convert.lisp is a file in my project, and listed under components as :file.
9:01:28
jack_rabbit
It's not listed as a package dependency. Any ideas what I'm doing wrong? I've never run into this before.
9:01:55
beach
jack_rabbit: "package" here means Common Lisp package, not ASDF "system".
9:02:21
beach
jack_rabbit: So you are probably using a package prefix or IN-PACKAGE before you do the DEFPACKAGE.
9:02:38
beach
No wait. That doesn't sound right.
9:03:05
beach
are you sure about the message. There seems to be a space in the name of the component.
9:03:20
jack_rabbit
NOPE! I missed some quotes.
9:03:26
jack_rabbit
Yes, that's the issue.
9:03:42
jack_rabbit
Dependency was "package html-convert" rather than "package" "html-convert"
9:04:10
jack_rabbit
Thanks. Sorry to trouble over silly mistakes.
10:11:55
smokeink
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FvmTSpJU-Xc Alan Kay - Normal Considered Harmful
11:57:09
cuso4
I am doing one of my physics problems in lisp
11:57:40
cuso4
And I get a floating point overflow error. But I can't seem to find anything online on how to solve it
11:58:25
Bike
do you know what floating point overflow is?
12:00:58
cuso4
https://codeshare.io/2plJ0Y
12:01:05
cuso4
This is what the code looks like
12:01:54
cuso4
It is the e_total function that overflows for values of m>205
12:03:49
Bike
it means there's a floating point number that's too big to represent
12:04:26
Bike
check most-positive-single-float; it's probably around 3e38
12:04:47
Bike
c^4 is about 8e33, so if m_n is larger than ten thousand ish you're out of numbers
12:05:18
Bike
so you should use doubles instead of singles.
12:11:47
Bike
if you deal with really big values, you might have to finesse it to avoid computing that huge intermediate value that you then take the sqrt of, but i don't know how to do that off the top of my head
12:12:06
Bike
well. i guess you can write it as c*sqrt(mc^2+p)
12:14:48
cuso4
Of ccourse you could use some numerical methods too, but my current solution is good enough.
12:39:53
pjb
(expt 206 2) #| --> 42436 |#
17:53:27
akr
Hello, can someone please help me make sense of the "docs" for cl-opengl http://quickdocs.org/cl-opengl/api
17:53:38
akr
I want to create an opengl context on an already existing window
17:54:06
akr
I can get it through clx (bindings for xlib)
17:54:25
akr
but I don't know where to plug it in into cl-opengl
17:56:14
Shinmera
cl-opengl does not handle context or window creation. Those parts are heavily OS specific.
17:56:27
Shinmera
It only deals with the OpenGL API itself.
17:56:54
akr
hmm okay, what should I do then?
17:57:06
Shinmera
See glut, glfw, sdl2, glop, etc. to do that.
17:57:47
akr
aren't bindings to glut part of cl-opencl?
17:58:16
Shinmera
It's part of the project, but not part of the system.
17:58:28
Shinmera
Anyway, glut is /really old/, so I can't recommend using it.
17:58:48
Shinmera
Try cl-glfw3 or something.
18:00:51
Shinmera
glop is a "pure CL" attempt at doing the same, but it's a bit sketchy / underdeveloped in parts.
18:01:17
Shinmera
So depending on how you feel about foreign library dependencies...
18:02:05
akr
do you think I can plug the window obtained from xlib:screen-root directly into glfw:make-context-current?
18:05:02
Shinmera
All of these libraries will do the window creation for you. Is there any reason you want to do it yourself?
Sunday, 11th of March 2018, 18:05:18 UTC