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22:45:00
dim
this old code of mine is a little hard to debug with its use of make-broadcast-stream to capture output and errors of uiop:run-program in both the console and a log file
23:04:41
pjb
dim: it's not that it's hard, it's that it may need to be exhaustive: the condition hierarchy in your application may easily be the triple of the size of your application class hierarchy.
23:05:11
comborico1611
pjb: Portacle has been a life-saver for me. It should be one of the first things that comes out of the mouth of the Lisp community to beginners.
23:06:17
pjb
Having been into programming since 1975, I tend to either have learned stuff before stuff existed, or just have a natural preference to go to the main reference (however hard or arid it may be to read), and to build my own tools.
23:07:37
pjb
Of course, I can understand the interest of having nice pedagogical environments (and even perhaps IDEs for professional work), but the former should be the task of teachers, and the both require a lot of resources to develop and maintain.
23:07:38
Shinmera
I've ironed out some more bugs in portacle today. There should be a new release tomorrow.
23:08:12
comborico1611
pjb: Yes, but as an active contributor to assisting beginners, I'm just telling you what my experience has been. You listed your recommendation for newbies (emacs+paredit+slime).
23:11:21
comborico1611
pjb: I've never seen nor seen a reference to that website. Sometimes #lisp is going to be the first place a person goes to for info. Anyways, I'm not trying to debate what's the best resource avenue for a beginner, I'm just telling you what I think as a beginner. And that is Portacle is the best thing out there for the growth of Common Lisp.
23:12:02
pjb
comborico1611: but don't tell it to me, since I'm a seasonned lisper. Tell it to your fellow newbies, by updating this cliki page.
23:12:47
pjb
It's when you're learning that you know best what information you need to learn. Therefore it's now that you should document that, leavining little bread crumbs on cliki.net
23:14:10
pjb
And furthermore, have fun browsing this wiki, there is a lot of interesting informations and links.
23:16:00
comborico1611
pjb: Yeah, I think it is really adequate as it is. My verbage would sound very fanatical/fan-boy. The first subject of the page is Portacle, so that's on target.
2:58:38
shmup
which lisp has the best vim support? so slimv is a thing ok. i think with tpope's interest in clojure has developed a nicer thing for lisp/vim, though. are there other lisps which have had better attention/specific focus in vim?
3:02:30
shmup
heh. ok, i'll try again. which dialect of lisp has a nice vim community providing out of the box repl connection/spawning, mappings to eval an s-expression on current line, whole buffer, mappings defined for definition lookups, etc. tpope's clojure stuff is one example
3:04:29
stylewarning
Bike: I'm just using prin1-to-string (with print readably, *package* :keyword, and print pretty nil) and read-from-string
3:07:08
stylewarning
It's very hard to debug unfortunately. I can't replicate it locally, only in a SLAD binary.
3:36:46
aeth
"post-functional declarative programming" I guess would be declarative programming that's informed by recent trends in functional programming, but that's not functional.
3:37:05
aeth
(It also is post-functional because it used to run before it was rewritten to use that paradigm)
4:02:13
pillton
stylewarning: SLAD is fine I guess. Bike says it is hip and I am in no position to question Bike's wisdom on current street talk. I thought we said "a dumped image".
4:07:18
pierpa
stylewarning: no idea about this problem, but, just to exclude some hypothesis, can you see if changing the string to "COMMON-LISP::NIL" changes the result?
4:09:49
|3b|
(which is not a particularly conformant thing to do, so could cause any other random problems too)
4:10:28
|3b|
possibly something tried to unintern something else, without realizing it didn't have any something else (and so it had a NIL instead)
4:12:47
|3b|
ACTION tried, and it does have that effect, surprisingly without any package lock problems
6:50:46
flip214
uh.... why does https://www.european-lisp-symposium.org/ say "site not installed"!?!?!
6:53:32
jackdaniel
I wrote a small piece about rendering and CLIM: https://common-lisp.net/project/mcclim/posts/Sheets-as-ideal-forms.html
7:49:19
Shinmera
Didier and I had a few problems yesterday and only got them all worked out by evening.
7:52:15
Shinmera
One problem was his email hoster, so maybe that's related to the temp page being up, but I don't know.
10:19:58
p_l
anyone knows of somewhat complete SMTP implementation in Lisp? Specifically server-side...