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19:24:47
jackdaniel
question about test-style-width (http://bauhh.dyndns.org:8000/clim-spec/11-1.html#_585): what is "width of some representative character in the font"?
19:25:42
jackdaniel
as opposed to "it is width property of the character #\M" which is only about glyph width
19:26:32
jackdaniel
my rationale is as following: if we have a fixed-width font I'd expect that if I put rectangles of width text-style-width with alternating colors in a line and then draw a text there
19:28:12
jackdaniel
otherwise it is impossible to draw such grid using clim protocols for fixed font
19:48:52
scymtym
jackdaniel: that commit alone is not enough. i now think that we need to take a step back and actually specify what we want to achieve. i'm writing a draft now
19:59:41
jackdaniel
(if I were writing such document, in a section "goals" I'd put -- get over with these branches, because I have at least 3 more in the oven ;) more seriuosly though, thank you for working on that with me, I'm sure we'll avoid plenty of regressions thanks to your conscientiousness
20:00:17
jackdaniel
good night all o/ I'd appreciate comments on the text-style-width (even if it is only "I agree" ,)
20:04:34
scymtym
i can't wait to get this done as well. i would rather work on double buffering and the other stuff in my queue
3:15:53
ck_
As suspected there's not much immediate opportunity for Common Lisp, but it also doesn't seem to be totally out of the question.
4:01:27
beach
What I asked jackdaniel to do was the user interface, i.e., panes, menus, maybe "butcons" for different music elements. But I am still going the implementation of the model, and also the exact layout of the symbols.
4:04:11
beach
I also need to give some more thought to the input. Gsharp had a very efficient input technique, but I don't think it is adapted to a wide audience.
4:05:43
beach
I remove one painful aspect by a key innovation in Gsharp, namely not enforcing the meter.
4:06:57
beach
It is strange that other score editors have not figured that one out, especially since composers are known to use notation that does not enforce the meter. I guess it's because these editors were not written by composers or music engravers.
4:18:48
beach
One basic problem is that the duration of music elements varies a lot, so the user ends up having to select a different kind of music element for each new entry.
4:19:23
ck_
have you thought about using the time used for keyboard presses or mouse clicks for this?
4:21:50
ck_
I was thinking about entering notes by clicking on the staff, and -- for example -- holding the mouse button down and observing it cycle through eights, quarters, halfs and so on, then letting go at the right one
4:22:18
ck_
or using the scroll wheel [ or multi-finger gestures on a tablet ] to scroll through the times
4:24:09
beach
Maybe some pointer icon changes with the wheel, before the user clicks on the position.
4:24:37
beach
That would avoid this necessity of changing the mouse position and eye focus between each note.
4:29:55
beach
The other thing I have been thinking is to have two different presentation modes. One would be "preview" mode that presents the score as it would be printed. The other one would be "edit mode" in which there is additional information shown that is useful to the user, but that won't show up in the printed score.
4:31:22
beach
Preview mode could have lots of presentations on the screen that trigger different actions, so that the user doesn't have to move the eye focus to much to butcons, menus, and the like.
4:31:54
ck_
oh yes, I think a mode split like that is very prudent. Maybe one could call it even necessary
4:33:31
ck_
I'd like to talk with you about this some more, user interfaces are an interest of mine. Maybe on the weekend, or when you pick it back up
4:33:34
beach
So, I think we have identified a main goal, namely that the user should not have to move the pointer too far away from the place where music elements are currently inserted or altered.
6:08:30
jackdaniel
ck_: I did, I wrote a class hierarchy, some basic application frame and utilities (like computing offsets between notes and converting a note to either frequency or a midi key)