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3:51:22
ck_
slyrus_: iirc, you asked specifically about the bezier presentation and how to interact with it?
3:51:49
ck_
it is pretty customary to move those parts of the control polygon that are not interpolated relative to the ones that are
3:52:59
ck_
i.e. if you move the start point, the next control point moves with it; likewise with the point that connects the two cubic segments and both of the adjacent points
3:54:01
ck_
otherwise, it looks quite nice. There's some sluggishness to the redraw which is probably due to my X server being XQuartz
5:05:39
slyrus
ck, ok, thanks. Yeah, I should improve the bezier control point dragging stuff. I'm not sure if the performance is something I'm doing wrong or if things are just slow in general on XQuartz (the latter, I suspect, where "things" are McCLIM, not necessarily all X drawing).
5:11:30
loke
Xrender is hopefully much better. I don't think plain X drawing used much these days (at least not anwywhere where performance matters)
5:29:32
ck_
For the record: jackdaniel's Atlanta Functional Programming Common Lisp Study Group: McClim is here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3fxp2QYn7gw
7:14:41
beach
jackdaniel: When you pronounce "command", you should emphasize the A as in "commAnd". You tend to emphasize the O as in "cOmmand", which makes it sound like "comment".
7:25:46
beach
I have other things to do today, so I won't watch it all in one go, but I'll let you know what I think once I finish.
7:26:59
beach
For now, I am very impressed by your memory. Whenever I write a CLIM application, I have to look at other applications, or in the specification, in order to remember the structure of the :PANES and the :LAYOUTS arguments to DEFINE-APPLICATION-FRAME.
7:28:47
beach
I always use :display-function '<mumble> rather than :display-function #'mumble, so that I can define the display function later, and so that I can modify it on the fly. Just a hint.
7:34:57
jackdaniel
I have also experimented with syntactic sugar like this: (defapp <name> (slots/initargs) ,@body) which defines a single application-pane with display function body
7:37:44
jackdaniel
it could be. another thing is that my nick starts with "Jack", so it may be inprinted in someones brain if they interact with me on IRC daily
8:00:11
jackdaniel
(with a small derail: fixing ecl issues to have mcclim running on it and I've got absorbed a little with drag and drop)
8:01:05
jackdaniel
fun project idea for interested people: write immediate gui toolkit on top of clim-basic, that would a good illustration that lower-level abstractions are useful to write any kind of thing
8:05:26
beach
I think that's a good idea, and it corresponds to my idea of a structure for a better documentation. I think that users of traditional GUI toolkits would then recognize their old style.
8:37:38
ck_
hmm, okay, how about taking a look at popular toolkits and creating a tutorial similar to theirs, for a simple application.
8:40:48
ck_
Qt, for example, has something like this as a 'first application' tutorial: https://doc.qt.io/qt-5/qtwidgets-tutorials-notepad-example.html
8:41:15
jackdaniel
ah, yes, when we have this 'sample toolkit" having a tutorial would be definetely a good thing
9:14:47
loke
jackdaniel: watching your presentation now. May I ask what kind of keybaord you're using? It makes a very distinct sound.
9:22:22
jackdaniel
apparently google is very anxious about letting people without google account to access hangouts (even when a direct invitation is sent to different email)
9:22:29
loke
jackdaniel: what kind of amazing laptop is that? :-) I wish I had a laptop with a keyboard that sounds like that.
9:23:01
jackdaniel
so I had to use a laptop where I have an google account for consultancy work (on bigger machine I have no active google logins whatsoever)
10:52:17
jackdaniel
(there is a polish silly song: "była sobie żabka mała" - re re kum kum is the noise of the frog and kum phonetically-wise would be qm)
11:08:11
scymtym
now that i have a bit of time, the first thing i'm going to do is making another attempt to merge the new inspector into master
11:15:38
jackdaniel
another mini-project suggestion: see if user-command-table works and write a short guide how to use it to add (i.e) interactor commands to 3rd-party applications
11:18:30
jackdaniel
(I thought it is sort of global-command-table duplicate but for the end user to extend and disable/enable it on demand)
11:32:51
scymtym
so my plan is: 1) make a new branch based on the wip-new-inspector branch 2) remove all non-inspector commits and things that don't work with mcclim master 3) rename everything such that it replaces clouseau 4) collapse the ~ 150 commits to a couple of commits 5) make a pull request
11:40:56
jackdaniel
when you get to it I think that user documentation would be more useful as the first thing
11:41:35
scymtym
do we have established conventions for user documentation? if not, i would just write an org-mode file
11:43:09
jackdaniel
most documentation is in texinfo, beach converted part of it to latex, but I find the former better suited. as of the future, I believe we should use a CLIM tool to document things, but as many things work on it is stalled on my side
11:43:43
jackdaniel
if you write org documentation, then I think it would be better to put it in the same directory as the inspector itself