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7:44:07
beach
So I imagine CLISP can't use CLOS for more basic stuff. It needs the full compiler before it can load CLOS. Right?
7:44:58
beach
... whereas in SICL, I can write (defclass symbol ((%name ...) (%package ...)) :metaclass built-in-class)
7:49:17
beach
If I understand it right, the SBCL maintainers prefer the compiler not to use generic functions.
7:51:12
beach
Since I am basically the only person working on SICL, I can't afford such luxury as maintaining several object systems.
7:51:58
beach
... so not only do I only use a single object system, but I use the CLOS machinery for most of the built-in stuff as well.
14:50:33
beach
ACTION wonders whether it is called GWOC in Australasia, or whether they do it at a different time of year there.
14:52:40
beach
In the tropics, it could be Google Rainy Season Of Code or Google Dry Season of Code.
14:58:42
beach
https://www.newzealand.com/us/article/new-zealand-aotearoa-the-land-of-the-long-white-cloud/
15:07:24
drmeister
And yes - we contribute all of our cleavir changes back to cleavir. In reality, we don't have a separate eclector, cleavir, whatever repository - we use the core ones.
15:10:16
drmeister
Bike works hard to implement things in a general way that can benefit these core projects.
15:13:41
Bike
these are trivial mvp1s so i can probably fix that, but it'll still be a factor for cleavir classes that have :after methods in initialization
15:14:54
Bike
at least it's nice that it's fast enough that i have to worry about this crap, i guess
15:18:16
beach
Well, implementation-specific code is normal. But it is best if it can be done by using the protocols as they were intended. If it is not possible, the protocols should be improved.
15:19:31
Bike
i've thought a bit about how mop could be modified to support what i'm doing here... i don't think it could really work, though
15:21:51
Bike
beach: well, for the "simple" use, i think the examples on define-method-combination explaining how they work with standard method combination are comprehensible enough
15:23:30
beach
I don't think SICL has make-method and call-method, simply because I didn't understand them fully.
15:30:34
drmeister
Bike: It's not hard - it's that the quality of the disassembly is poor because there are no symbols.
15:31:46
drmeister
Personally, I've used lldb and haven't put the hour or so it will take to get disassemble working.
15:35:05
drmeister
We rescheduled for April 3. We have a lot of snow here today and schools are closed or have delayed opening times - and my hosts won't be in until after noon.
15:43:50
drmeister
Re the disassembler - functions that we COMPILE we can get start and end addresses for the functions.
15:44:29
drmeister
Functions that are COMPILE-FILE'd we only get the start and so you have to specify how many instructions you want to disassemble.
16:22:49
Bike
actually these encloses are due to (funcall (lambda ...) ...), so i guess it comes back to inlining. bla
16:46:48
Bike
now it spends maybe a third of its time allocating, which seems more like how making instances should go. ideally i guess allocating should take almost all of it
16:48:26
drmeister
stassats: I get them from COMPILE by hijacking a feature of the ORC JIT engine that provides info on code that is JIT compiled. There is nothing like that for COMPILE-FILE'd code.
16:49:43
Bike
somehow it's calling find-class, which it shouldn't be, and the trace has a bunch of useless pointers in it