freenode/#abcl - IRC Chatlog
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14:10:04
letest1
Hi, question: is it possible to embed seamlessly abcl in a java application without needing to import the lisp source files manually?
14:10:56
easye
letest1: Yes, one can simply include the Maven artifacts in your build, and it will run.
14:12:44
letest1
thanks easye. I included the maven artifact but I'm not sure how I proceed. I have hard times finding examples and there's no framework support from IntelliJ.
14:14:54
easye
If you know anything about Clojure, you might study <https://github.com/lsevero/abclj>
14:15:26
easye
A lot depends on how you want to use Common Lisp. The User Manual has a whole section on using Lisp from Java.
14:18:58
letest1
Thanks. Basically I want to use Java to expose apis (Rest), send events to other services (Kafka for example) and thus all the infrastructure part,leaving domain and business logic to lisp. I would thus create an interop layer between java and abcl.
14:19:04
easye
For use in a Java Servlet, there are various examples around. My version (was) <https://bitbucket.org/easye/abcl-servlet> but I apparently didn't move it to github.
14:20:28
easye
For running a standalone ABCL with REST, I have used RESTAS in the past to good success, which is a Ruby-on-Rails like facade for routes over Hunchentoot.
14:20:56
easye
letest1: Are you familar with other Common Lisp implementations or are you new to Lisp?
14:21:58
letest1
I'm reasonably new. Chapter 4 of SICP (with Racket) and reading Ansi Common Lisp (Paul Graham).
14:23:35
easye
Alright, so you kinda need to bootstrap your knowledge of what is available via Quicklisp that you don't have to write everything yourself.
14:24:27
easye
Feel free to pose questions here, and I will try to answer to the best of my ability asyncrhonously.
14:25:57
easye
Thanks. Lemme know how far you get, and I will reply to that message in several hours.
17:36:22
etimmons
While that's definitely useful for Docker, I'm inclined to push forward on getting 1.8.0 into the Official Images
17:37:11
etimmons
Adding a new image is a much slower process than updating one, so I'd like to get it started (probably shortly after we figure out the CLF org)
18:04:57
easye
etimmons: ACK. There's some basic bugs in 1.8.0 that I am (slowly) fixing, so abcl-1.8.1 will be even better. But getting 1.8.0 as official as soon as possible is certainly the way forward.
18:06:38
easye
etimmons: Did gendl get back to ya on the official Docker hub group today? I should bug him again. He's cheerfully dealing with a son home from the pandemic who has decided he wants to do CompSci.
18:11:35
easye
I never was a big fan of the "Zippy the Pinhead" comic, but it is certainly entertaining text to feed Eliza.
18:12:55
easye
Later, I did a whole bunch of work with ABCL to get giant "Numberjack" numbers bouncing around in Minecraft.
18:14:45
easye
But to this day, when she gets to a Mac, she opens a Terminal and launches M-x doctor in Emacs.
18:16:49
etimmons
Haha, love it! Not sure how old she is, but I feel like Lisp is probably an acquired taste. I certainly doubt I'd appreciate it as much of I hadn't plowed through C, Java, and Python first
18:17:45
easye
Me too. I used learned Emacs when I had a 2400 baud mode so I could read the man pages while I coded.
18:18:13
easye
But elisp was just this funny configuration language that I script kiddied snipets I found on USENET>
18:23:57
easye
My daughter is 11 now. As is the case for a lot of "programmer parents", she isn't interested so much in hacking downwards, towards a Van Neumann archictecure, as hacking upwards, to using Minecraft mods, making video content with friends, etc.
18:26:54
etimmons
I never used USENET, so I don't know what I'm missing out on, but I can sympathize with the desire for historical groups to be available
18:29:05
easye
Yeah, USENET had it historical moment. The original social media if you will. Post 1993 (when the NSF allowed non-commercial traffic on the networks that BBN was running) was probably the point when it started to decline.
18:30:35
easye
Over the 90's, the USENET culture shifted to mailing lists like cypherpunks, and the technical groups around the operating systems (freebsd, linux, openbsd, etc.)
18:33:35
pjb
etimmons: there are archives of usenet, for the history. And you can see some indexed extract, eg. at http://informatimago.com/articles/usenet.html
18:35:45
easye
pjb: do you know offhand how big the non-binary uuencoded groups were back in say 1990?
18:41:34
pjb
The archive of messages from 1982 to 1986 contains 591702 bytes 1982-1986.mbx.tar.gz. For newer messages see https://github.com/noend2/comp.lang.lisp-archive.
18:46:07
easye
letest1: I migrated <https://github.com/easye/abcl-servlet> from my Mercurial copy. It shows how to host ABCL as a Java servlet, packaged as a "war". Not entirely in line with the more modern Java frameworks you mentioned, but still interesting to study.